[theme music plays]

Jen Richler: Hello, Can We Talk? listeners, it's Jen Richler, and I'm here with Nahanni Rous and Judith Rosenbaum, my partners in podcasting. And we are here to reflect, to reminisce, to kvell, um, because it is our 120th episode. Hello, Judith, and hello, Nahanni.

Judith Rosenbaum: Hello!

Nahanni Rous: Hi, Jen!

Jen: So, okay, why 120? In Jewish tradition, it's customary to wish someone "until 120" or, in Yiddish or Hebrew, biz hundert un tsvantsik on their birthday. In Genesis, 120 is given as the maximum normal lifespan. So, Judith and Nahanni, on the one hand, I say mazal tov on this auspicious occasion, but I also, at the same time, would like to think that the podcast has not reached the end of its lifespan.

Judith: That is true. We were excited to celebrate this milestone, but of course, we're not seeing it as the bookend of anything.

[clips of people giving appreciation messages in different languages]

Jen: So I want to go back to the beginning and talk a bit about how the podcast got started. I wasn't around, uh, when Can We Talk? first got started. So, Nahanni and Judith, I want you to tell us a little bit about the origin story of Can We Talk? and how the idea for the show first took shape.

Nahanni: You know, I think we started talking about doing a podcast together almost exactly ten years ago. I think it was the fall of 2014.

Judith: I mean, it took us about a year to launch it—we launched it a year later—but that was when we started really dreaming together about what it could be, and what it would look like, and, you know...

Nahanni: What it might be called—one of the biggest challenges that we faced.

Judith: Right, it took us a whole year to figure that one out.

Jen: So yeah, those are some of my questions. Actually, what was the vision for the podcast when you were starting to have those early conversations? Because there's obviously a lot of ways it could go.

Nahanni: Well, from the beginning, I always really wanted it to sound good. Like, I wanted it to be a podcast that people would enjoy listening to, where we would use audio creatively and, you know, be attentive to a level of detail that would make it a nice listening experience for people. And we wanted to tell compelling stories about Jewish women and to convey the idea that Jewish women can do and be so many different things.

Judith: Yeah, I mean, I think I had this sense that people have so many stereotypes and preconceptions about who Jewish women are and, like, what Jewish women's stories would be. And we wanted to just blow that open.

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[clips play]

Noah: This is Noah Efron. As the host of The Promised Podcast for the last fourteen years, I can say from experience— oh my God, Can We Talk? is so good. Each episode on its own is delightful. Who knew that the arrival of klezmer music has a queer history? Who knew that the Jane Collective and the fight for reproductive rights in the United States has a Jewish history? Who knew that Jewish women were behind seances and mediums and mesmerism back in the day? The whole podcast is mesmerizing. But there is also a whole being bigger than the sum of its parts aspect to Can We Talk? After you listen for a while, everything you thought you knew about Jewish history and Jewish culture, it all starts to shift. And it’s weird at first, but then you realize that this is what Jewish history is, once you stop overlooking Jewish women. It is full of passion and color and meaning and fascination. So congratulations on reaching 120 episodes, a biblical milestone, of course. Sarah lived to be 127, and Methuselah lived to be 969, I’m just saying. Thank you, Can We Talk?, for rocking my world.

Rebecca: My name is Rebecca and I’m from Berkeley, California. I listen to a lot of podcasts, but I keep coming back to Can We Talk? What I love about it is that even though it has a narrow focus on the experiences of Jewish women, this focus is like an aperture into a tremendous breadth of topics across time and place. Some of the episodes that have stayed with me include the one about the girl who read from the Torah in braille at her bat mitzvah. And the one about Ladino speakers in Turkey keeping this language alive. Mazel tov to the Can We Talk? team for reaching this milestone of 120 episodes. I look forward to the next season.

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Jen: Since Nahanni brought it up, how did you come up with the name?

Nahanni: We talked about so many different things. Honestly, I don't even know if we should talk about some of the ideas that we had that didn't fly because some of them were really embarrassing.

Judith: I don't even remember them anymore.

Jen: Well, now I want to hear them.

Nahanni: I remember, uh, somebody suggesting something like Eve's Rib or something like that.

Judith: We talked about things like Broadly Speaking—like, B-R-O-A-D—but there was something else that was using "broad" in that sense.

Nahanni: We also talked about That Time of the Month.

Judith: Right. Oh my God, I forgot about that.

Nahanni: Remember? Because at first, we were going to be doing only a monthly podcast. So it was like, "Hey, this is That Time of the Month." [laughs]

Judith: I'm really glad we didn't do that. That's so cringey.

Judith: I think part of what we liked about Can We Talk? was that it was the catchphrase of Joan Rivers, and we wanted something that had a historical hook to something that had to do with Jewish women. And it also gave us the image that we could use for the podcast, which is based on a famous photograph of Joan.

And the way that it didn’t fit—which I think we weren’t totally crazy about—was that we’re not generally just a talk podcast, and Can We Talk? sounds like it’s going to be a podcast where people are, like, dishing, and that’s not really our vibe.

Nahanni: Especially in the beginning. I mean, in the beginning, we were much more tightly scripted, and we’ve opened it up a lot more now to include more conversations and straight-up interviews. We’ve kind of come around a little bit to that. 

The other thing I do like about the title is it’s very inviting.

Judith: Right, it feels sort of inclusive.

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[clips play]

Susan: Hello, it’s Susan Stamberg from NPR, and I’m remembering the interview that we did a while ago about women’s voices in broadcasting. Uh, it was a conversation we had in 2018 and I’m back in touch with you again because I really wanted to congratulate you on this milestone. That’s amazing— 120 is a big number. It’s actually older than I am. But what I remember is how much fun it was to talk with you and be part of the Jewish Women’s Archive. So thank you for asking me, congratulations to everybody, don’t feel older than I. I hope you have many, many more years on your horizon. 

Judy: Hi, it’s Judy Gold, and I want to wish Can We Talk? congratulations on their 120th episode and what— I mean, what an accomplishment! Here's to 120 more, and then 120 after that, and that would be 360 episodes which would be twenty times chai. See what I did there? Also, 120 is 6.66 times chai. Uh oh… mazel tov!

Linda: Hi, I’m Linda Gradstein in Jerusalem. I first met Nahanni in 2002 when I was the NPR correspondent in Jerusalem and Nahanni was my intern. It was fun to work together years later on this story about women in Israeli politics for Can We Talk? and I wanted to wish you all a mazel tov on your 120th episode.

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Jen: Was there anything about when you started producing the podcast that surprised you?

Nahanni: Um, I mean, I think I was used to looking for compelling stories, and I wasn’t used to always looking for stories that had a gender angle. And I guess, surprise—like, a lot of stories have gender angles. So maybe that was sort of something that did surprise me. But not to be trite about it, I think I’ve learned a lot from looking through the gender lens at stories.

Judith: I don’t come from an audio background—I come from a podcast fangirl background—but, like, I feel like I’ve learned a ton, especially in the early years, Nahanni, from you around, like, what a story is. Like, I’m an idea person. I’ll be like, “This is such an interesting idea,” and Nahanni would be like, “Right, but what’s, like, the story?”

Nahanni: Well, I think, like, right back at you, Judith, I feel like I’ve learned so much from you about telling stories in a historical context.

Jen: Yeah, I feel like Judith is often, like, our historical consultant.

Nahanni: Oh yeah.

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[clips play]

Daniel: This is Daniel Moses, from Silver Spring, Maryland. What I love about Can We Talk? is how it opens windows into very interesting aspects of our history and our past. But what’s amazing to me and what’s so inspiring to me is how often those lessons from the past can open up pathways for the future. And a lot of the lessons I learned from Can We Talk? is how to take those lessons from the past and apply them in a future-looking way, in a way that we can help forge a much better future for ourselves as we root ourselves in the past.

Liz: Hi, my name is Liz and I’m from Washington, DC. An episode that really stood out to me was the one about rebbetzins in America. It’s easy to think about women’s history and think about these turning points where women are gaining access to something or being able to do something that they couldn't do before, and I think it’s important to remember that women who couldn’t be rabbis also found ways to be leaders in their communities and to make change, and that being a rebbetzin is a part of that. I think a lot of us, including myself, are straddling that sort of reverence for women in the past in traditional roles and also my identity as a feminist, and a lot of the stories from the Jewish Women’s Archive feel like they are also living in that complex messiness of holding both at the same time. Um, I think I’ve also just loved since October 7 getting to hear voices of other women feeling the silence of the international feminist community, and in moments that I felt really alone and like those stories aren't being told, Can We Talk? is a place to hear people and just feel less alone in that.

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Judith: The last nine years have been momentous and intense, and I feel like the podcast has been a way that we have processed some of it. Whether it’s Trump’s election in 2016, October 7, the election last week, the #MeToo movement, or the pandemic—these things have been huge, and we’ve had to grapple with and respond to them.

And it’s also been joyful lots of times and filled with adventures.

Jen: Let’s talk more about the joyful part. When you look back, what are some of your favorite podcast moments?

Nahanni: Well, Judith, you mentioned the Women’s March in 2017.

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[clip of Women’s March plays]

Chants: Show me what democracy looks like, this is what democracy looks like! Tell me what democracy looks like!

Girl: This is what democracy looks like, this is what is supposed to happen.

Nahanni: Getting to be there with our daughters was so inspiring.

Judith: Yeah, that was amazing.

[clip: Nahanni interviewing her daughter]

Nahanni: Shalvah, I’m gonna interview you in the tree, okay?

Shalvah: Okay!

Nahanni: Can you tell me your name, please, and where you're from?

Shalvah: You just said! My name is Shalvah Lazarus and I live in DC, and I am your daughter. I’m nine years old. I think that this is just amazing and I’m so glad to be here. [sighs]

Ma’ayan: I’m Ma’ayan Zimrah Rosenbaum. I’m from Boston Massachusetts. I turned ten the day after the election. It’s been really stressful because you know if you see people, like twenty, thirty, forty years older than you being, like, so worried you know, like,  this is my cue to be worried! Um, but I think even though we have someone not so strong leading America I think that if we take action and resist then we can make a big change.

Judith: All of the times we did stuff with our daughters were pretty fun.

[instrumental music plays]

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[clip: Shalvah and Ma'ayan on Zoom, present-day]

Ma'ayan: Hi! Sorry.

Shalvah: Oh my God! There we go. Okay, yay.

Shalvah: I’m Shalvah Lazarus and I’m the daughter of Nahanni Rous. 

Ma’ayan: I’m Ma’yan Rosenbaum and I’m the daughter of Judith Rosenbaum. After our years long hiatus, we’re back on the podcast!

Shalvah: Yeah! It’s been a minute. One of the first things I thought about when Trump won this election was being interviewed when I was nine at the Women’s March with Ma’ayan for this podcast. I remember I was in a tree when we were getting interviewed.

Ma’ayan: Yes!

Shalvah: Were you wearing one of the pink hats?

Ma’ayan: Yes, I loved that hat. I didn’t take it off for, like, a month. One of my favorite things about the podcast is getting these in-depth zooms on little bits of history and then finding out that they have this entire Jewish feminist history that I would’ve had no idea about. 

Shalvah: Yeah, and finding these Jewish cultural pockets that I never would encounter. Iranian singers or Claudia Roden and her recipes and how all of these are just puzzle pieces in the huge picture of culture in the world and gender in the world and Jewish culture and gender. And it’s amazing how well the people who work on Can We Talk? can use sound alone to make such worlds stay alive and preserved.

Ma’ayan: The mysterious people behind the scenes who we may or may not know… 

Shalvah: [laughs] "I’m your host, Nahanni Rous." 

Ma’ayan: I heart Can We Talk?

Shalvah: I love Can We Talk?

[instrumental music plays]

Maya: Hi, my name is Maya and I live in Bloomington, Indiana, and I am Jen’s daughter. My favorite episode was the 100th anniversary of the first bat mitzvah. I am twelve years old and I’m preparing for my bat mitzvah, and it’s just very relatable to me. And as I was listening to that episode, you know, I got to notice or realize that I was very grateful and I’m very fortunate for the fact that I get to have a bat mitzvah that is the same as the boys, the same as what my brother’s bar mitzvah was like. And I’m very grateful also for the people who fought, like the women and their parents who fought for this equality. So mazel tov to Can We Talk'’s 120th episode, and I’m excited for many more!

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Judith: I’m also remembering when we went to the Democratic National Convention in 2016.

[clip plays]

Nahanni: Judith and I are here at the Democratic National Convention in Philadelphia. 

Judith: It’s obvious that this is a historic moment…Well, it’s a historic moment for everyone, but it’s clear what the gender story is in this particular historic moment. We were also interested in whether there’s a particular Jewish women's story here at the convention.

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Judith: We got press passes for the podcast, and we drove home super late at night. Then we had this sense—whether it was accurate or not—that we had to get the podcast episode out right away so it would feel fresh. So we basically stayed up all night. We drove late into the night or practically all night, then stopped at my parents’ house in New Haven. We produced the episode right then and there and released it the next morning or something like that.

Nahanni: It was really fun.

Judith: Yeah, it had that road trip, all-nighter energy that we don’t get to do that much anymore. We were kind of fired up coming from that event.

Nahanni: Yeah. Way back years ago, I did an episode about Mahjong, and I got to join this group of women who had been meeting to play Mahjong every week for decades.

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[clip plays]

Woman: Mahjong, you play for yourself. I don’t care if I win or lose, what difference does it make? And it’s not just playing, it’s talking about life, which is very important.

[sounds of game in the background]

Woman: It’s awful quiet over there.

Woman: I have nothing! I just got a tiny something, I don’t know what to do with this tiny something. 

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Nahanni: And it was so much fun. I didn’t know how to play Mahjong, so they taught me. I listened to them chat and eat snacks. It was just a reminder—we do a lot of serious episodes—and it reminded me of the real importance of women just getting together to enjoy each other’s company.

Judith: Yeah, that was a great one. We’ve done some amazing episodes that have brought together people across generations. I’m thinking about our second episode, which was about Our Bodies, Ourselves. We interviewed one of the founders, Vilunya Diskin, at her home, but her daughter and granddaughter were also there as part of the conversation.

It was a really snowy night—I remember sliding all over the road as we were driving to her house—she lives on a hill. Then we came in, and it was warm and cozy.

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[clip plays]

Vilunya: Welcome, you intrepid folks! Alright girly cues, they’re here!

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Judith: It was just this wonderful moment of women gathering together from different ages and life stages, reflecting on issues of women’s health and activism. It was so nourishing.

[clip plays]

Samara: Hi, my name is Samara and I’m from Toronto, Canada. I love to listen to the Can We Talk? podcast on Friday mornings while I’m making challah for Shabbat. I turn on a new episode and get all of my ingredients ready and mix and knead away while I’m learning something new and connecting to Judaism and learning about issues that pertain to Jewish women while I’m performing a mitzvah that Jewish women have performed for generations. So it’s a great way to start my Fridays and helps me bring in Shabbat.

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Nahanni: I wanted to ask you, Jen, because you’ve been asking us a lot of questions. What has felt most rewarding for you about working on Can We Talk?

Jen: Yeah, I mean, I think it connects to something you said earlier about the different kinds of things Jewish women can do or be. I’ve been working on the podcast for a little over three years, and I’ve thought it would be fun to go back and list all the different people I’ve interviewed for episodes.

It could easily be in the hundreds. For you, I’m sure it’s a lot more. I just think it’s amazing—the sheer number. Then, if you start looking at all the different walks of life, ages, backgrounds, and professions—it’s just blown open my idea of what Jewish women’s stories could be.

Like, there’s just something really exciting about that. And it’s funny, I don’t know if I’ve ever mentioned this on the podcast, but my background is in clinical psychology. That’s what I got my graduate degree in, and I sometimes joke that I’m really using my degree a lot as a podcaster—ha ha.

But I mean, I think what I’ve always loved is asking people questions and getting them to talk. I’m fascinated by people, and what a fun job that I get to just talk to lots of people and fire questions at them. It’s so exciting to get to do that for my job.

[theme music plays]

Judith: One of my favorite things about the work I get to do is working collaboratively with people—really creative, wonderful people who I enjoy working with, spending time with, and learning from. From the beginning, the podcast has been such a great collaborative project, and it’s really fun to do it with both of you.

Nahanni: I agree. I feel the same way.

Jen: Okay, well, here’s to at least 120 more episodes. Mazal tov to you, Judith, and to you, Nahanni—and to all of us.

[theme music plays]

Jen: Thanks so much to all of our guests and listeners who sent us messages of appreciation from four countries in six languages, including our daughters Ma’ayan Rosenbaum, Shalvah Lazarus, and Maya Stoffman.

Until 121! See you next time.